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Beat Your Genes Podcast & More

Living Wisdom Library Q&A
2021-07-04
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hey how you doing good we're in business that was easy it's an easy technological transition so motown's excited he's ready to party all right just give folks a minute looks like they're filtering in here how are you good good how about yourself good feeling patriotic today there you go I don't see any Flags waving in the background you're falling down on your on your patriotic Duty sorry about that that's uh yeah come on beauty of America said I don't have to hustle that hard I saw a uh a breathless editorial in the New York Times today I think it wasn't even an editorial it was it was an actual news piece about how the flag has become a very divisive symbol in in the country and so you know it's no longer value neutral or non-partisan to embrace the American flag which is the a little bit tragic so wow yeah yeah this is the first um there's really like a lot you know this has been a drift in it it's cultural tide for a long time but I'm seeing just a lot of it is irresponsible to have love for this country on this day and to celebrate anything American and it's all kind of you know problematic and Colonial so that has really reached a fever pitch this year I think yeah yeah oh well I can I can I can only hope that it's like vomit you know what I mean like this through this moment of uh crisis and then and it's over and you're back to back to something that resumes normal so let's hope so then there's usually another little vomits you know what I mean hopefully this is the big vomit yeah anything like Motown there are several the first definitely guarantees that you might as well just get more cleaning supplies because you're in for a wild ride all right well let's see what we have here I had um there was one question just in the I think we're going to probably um I I'm gonna ask Sam to do away with the upvote down vote or at least to try to do away with the down vote on the question tool I've had several people sort of upset by it and uh saying that it attracts just disagreeable troll-like behavior and I think people are not using it a lot so they're sort of the things they're have the most votes tend to be older questions and some of the newer questions are not rising to the surface so we're going to try to kind of do something about that um but there was a question about when with I can't find it right now but I remember it it was about crystal clear and when you're doing Crystal Clear when is it appropriate to jump in and defend yourself I.E the other person is really getting it wrong is really saying well you did this and then you did that and that made me feel blah blah blah and they're they're factually Incorrect and and it's very hard to sit on your hands and let them report the history in an incorrect way is it is it appropriate to jump in before they've said their piece or do you just lump it and wait until you get to the end so um depending on what the situation is you uh here's actually your job acrylic crystal clear and here's the purpose of it um so the purpose of it is that they need to feel like they got their old piece set okay and you need to make sure that you understand what it is that they're saying and how they're connecting all the dots so you're not going to defend yourself at all okay so that you you are that's the whole purpose of crystal clear is that you can feed back to them what it is when we're done with Crystal Clear you can actually you're going to feed back to them essentially a perfect representation of what it is that they've said and what their what their defense was or what their argument was for why it is that they're in the position that they're in you what you want at the end is for them to be saying yes that's right okay that's that now they can relax okay now now for the first time you understand completely uh in a great detail what their what their rationale is and why it is that they think the way that they think okay there are um there's only a few possibilities in human conflict so uh one of them is that that there is a distortion about what people understand uh the truth is or the actual facts are of the situation uh the other possibility is that the other person is uh so disagreeable is to be unreasonable and that they can't be you can't transact with that so those are those are really that's the universe of basic alternatives so Crystal Clear is the notion that we are going to uh we are going to give it every possibility to discover that in fact that they are sufficiently reasonable that we can actually negotiate with them once we have an understanding about where it is that we disagree okay so because once we understand awareness that we disagree what these are then is these are really uh questions of fact in other words now it's about if you thought that I said that at some point I don't remember saying that but if that's what you thought I said then you have the reaction and then you did this to me as a result of that I can understand why you did that but you can you know but now I'm explaining why it is that I didn't I didn't see that piece of it so when you did that to me then I did that to you okay and that's why that happened but I wouldn't have done that yeah I mean you're saying you wouldn't have done that move on me had I not done that move on you but I actually don't remember doing that move on you and I don't understand why I would have been motivated to do so so that's that's the kind of a situation where we start to diffuse the fury because we're actually talking about where we're where we're disagreeing is is on questions of fact okay and we're not and then we have to we have to admit hey I'm not sure let's see how it is that we can determine what the facts are okay and we can even then take people down through hypotheticals well let's suppose that this were the case if this were the case if it were the truth that it was as I'm saying that I believe it is then what would you say okay in other words but they're only going to entertain that if we've actually gone through the trouble of getting all the way through crystal clear and feeding back to them so that they understand that we were extremely patient and that we understand their position okay the uh so that's all crystal clear is at the end of the day what uh this is actually a a little sub component of a of a wider principle that that sits under the uh the clinical uh picture that Jen and I have which I I actually believe is more or less unique in all Clinical Psychology and that is that that there is no therapy going back and re-parenting you and neither can we browbeat you with CBT like tactics into changing your personality okay um so CBT we believe is an advance over psychodynamic thinking in the sense that CBT isn't particularly interested in your life history and worrying about your little perks and pains or problems from your childhood however CBT does believe that your quote irrational thinking can be essentially pounded into some kind of submission and therefore you could change you can have an effectively personality change we don't believe that that's true okay so what we believe is that we believe that that's a big waste of time so the um where we believe the action is is that really the only place for improvement in life is increasing your precision and your understanding of reality that's really where it is it's it's about becoming more accurate and so Distortion uh Distortion might sometimes uh in a short-term basis be useful there's a thing called being blissfully ignorant sometimes you get away with it in this life okay uh you're blissfully ignorant that you're that your car was about to blow a tire going around a turn but you you didn't know it but uh but that but then it did and it saved your hide okay that that's a wild story that actually happened to my father who was on a winding Mountain Road uh in Idaho and uh with me and my sister in the car and my mother in the car at night going from uh I think uh Boise to Lewiston or Lewiston to Boise or some such thing and in the middle of the night fell asleep at the wheel and as he fell asleep at the wheel a tire blue that literally woke him up and dragged him around the curve wow otherwise four people are dead wow yeah so the uh so that that's Blissful ignorance he had no idea that that uh that that was going to save his hide and that that was a you know that that was sitting out there for him in in the unbelievable laws of probability against it so the programmers intervened in the simulation is what happened obviously that's what happened they just they weren't going to let my sister go down you know no it was all about it's all about your sister try to get her through that's right yeah so anyway there is there's Blissful ignorance that is true but there isn't Blissful ignorance in the long term uh because too too many uh events come up and if you are ignorant sooner or later you're going to pay a price for that ignorance because you're going to base your behavior around uh false assumptions and then there's going to be mistakes of varying the costs that's just how it works so the what we're attempting to do in all Quote therapy All Therapy is is education and all education is that's worth anything is actually education about the truth and that includes understanding the falsehoods that other people believe because the truth is their nervous system works according to what it is that they believe so it's worth understanding in some cases the falsehoods that they understand uh so that we can anticipate their behavior all right so this gets to be all kinds of wild and craziest we start thinking this thing grew but at the end of the day it's all about the truth okay so that's the only place where we are going to improve our situation is to actually have an increasingly precise understanding of the truth I.E the reduction of error and that's what Crystal Clear is about it's about to uh reduce the error in your understanding of what's motivating them and why it is that they feel the way they feel and why they're acting the way they act okay if you have a complete understanding uh of that that is hugely relieving for them because part of that person on the other side is extremely frustrated with you they don't understand you and they think that if you understood them they that you would see it the way they see it all right the question is whether or not that's true and it's not going to be true at the other end of it what we have a supplement special who has a vast you know a vastly distorted view relative to your understanding what what would be reasonable and fair uh if they have a a a disagreement there then you have a disagreement that's not resolvable okay so Crystal Clear is it is the ultimate method for seeing whether or not you have a disagreement that can other that could actually be resolved through what understanding the truth okay uh there are people that can't understand the truth if you're if you're an 80 20 Trader you just can't you go through life not understanding that you are distorted in your concept of fairness you just keep being pissed off all the time we don't know anybody like that good thing sounds sounds super stressful so uh so anyway that that's that is the prescription of crystal clear is to be extremely patient because as you're doing that you're also building your credits that they need to reciprocate okay so so you then are going to be uh you're going to be afforded the very same patients or and or you're certainly going to insist that that's true but you have to earn it uh somebody has to begin and show the remarkable or restraint Goodwill and interest in understanding what the other person is thinking uh once you've got the entire dossier on uh what that is then you're in a position to to essentially come back and and feed it back the other direction all right very good yeah that gets to the this there was a follow-up point on that question that somebody else had responded to which um was something to the effect of oh I I find crystal clear is successful with the women in my life this was a the person was speaking as a female um but that I have it's harder with men because they find the um the questions rude and and they feel like they're being interrupted but you're really just looking at personality limitations you're dealing with disagreeable males um males tending to be more disagreeable in general not always but that's the the drift of the bell curve um and you're running into the limitations of the exercise and so that's telling you it's giving you its own kind of information so yeah yeah all good lowman's specials all right yeah um we have we have a thoughtful question about flemen but um before I get to that there's just a very quick clarification here is down arrow the same as quote gaming it out um we says that you've used the latter term recently I would say more or less yeah sort of when we talk about down arrow it's following the the worst case scenario to its ultimate end which is you know everybody's dead usually um and it's just a way to put your troubles in perspective so you know it's a worst case scenario gaming out of your Alternatives and where things could go so yeah I think those are more or less equivalent and that's again that's an exercise that's good for some people not helpful for other people this is sort of you know take what works and leave the rest um crystal clear works for certain personalities certain personality equilibriums not for others down arrow can be massively anxiety inducing for some people but not for others ironically can be you know can be helpful for people less emotionally stable people really high conscientious sort of spinning on a lot of things just dialing down to the absolute worst case scenario can actually be a liberating process for some of those people but not for everybody so you really have to all of this is about knowing yourself and and understanding how to use these tools to build your own environment um not all of them are going to apply to everybody all of the time yeah yeah which gets us to this question which is a good question from Patrick here so having read ploman's blueprint it occurs to me that his concept of environmental factors influencing the behavior of the individual appears to differ from your ideas Plumbing claims that environmental factors are mostly serendipitous random and non-systemic the environmental interventions you two recommend on the other hand seem rather well thought out designed with a clear purpose in mind and in that sense far from accidental in both intention and effect am I wrong or does your point of view somewhat clash with plummon's ideas in that regard I think we're talking about plumbing plumbing talking about environmental interventions to shape a personality and and we're talking about environmental interventions to accommodate an existing personality so so it's somewhat apples and oranges um we're not we're not saying that you can make these environmental changes in your life or the the life that you have with somebody else and that's it's going to fundamentally affect who you are just like plum is saying that anything that parents do to try to turn their children into Baby Einstein is not going it's not going to fundamentally change the IQ or the personality of that child but it might be a more beneficial environment for who that child really is so we're we're engaged in the same project I think if that do you have you have other thoughts on that no I just love it it was so it was so articulate it was just much better than I was going to do uh yeah this is I think it's just that yeah it sometimes can be those two things can get confused for sure so when we're talking about you know Finding Your the right environment for your potted plant and all of that that's post personality creation we we cannot go back no matter who who tells you you can't go you can't change your personality you can just well so one of the examples I often use is my dogs and fireworks which is apropos of the Fourth of July special that we're having so Motown who's sitting right behind me here is a very nervous little dude I mean Doug's met him he's he's compared to my other dog much more emotionally unstable um much more agreeable much much you know much more extroverted he has all these lovely characteristics but he's quite unstable and fireworks really bother him a lot and so for this weekend I have him in the quietest apart from the train blaring outside the quietest kind of I'm I'm further from the fireworks than I would be if I were elsewhere I'm keeping him I'm I'm trying to control his little goldfish tank as well as I can knowing that he's unstable and knowing that if he heard a bunch of fireworks he'd be having a very very hard time so it doesn't make him less likely to be reactive to it it just gives him a better quality of life if he's if he's less exposed to it so I can control that um and even though it's more boring for Melly that's a that's a trade-off that I'm willing to make to keep him to to give him a better experience that's all we're really talking about all good perfect yeah all right um all right keep the questions coming you guys let's see what else we have here so this is a just a pleasure trap question or sort of a personality pleasure trap question I'm mid 40s female lost a bunch of weight on Whole Food plant-based working home no kids highly active taking multiple high intensity gym classes daily with gym rats in their 20s and 30s and getting chatted up by cute younger gym instructors lately having major sexual desires but do not want to cheat on my husband and ruin my marriage how can I stop this I don't want to stop going to the classes either please help foreign I I mean this is this is the environment that you're in you're you're I don't think you can stop the desires that's you know this isn't sort of a um you know we we can't uh put you through that kind of training I think you're you're recalibrating you're in a process where you're you've changed your mate value essentially and you're getting flirted with with these attractive young prospects and it's Awakening some Notions within you and um so this is likely going to be a process that settles down over time I mean I think you're you're wanting to look at the at the health of your marriage too so I mean is your husband still qualifying are you qualifying for him um so what is the dynamic there uh is this just about the feedback that you're getting from the instructors or is there something um that is more off with the marriage that you're looking to compensate for so you know separating those out because both of those things could be happening is important to look at I think um and maybe maybe going to classes with different people I can't imagine that all of these people are equally interesting to you there's probably one or two that are really dig in your circuits um and if they're really causing a lot of problems and you're having a lot of intrusive thoughts about them then the first line of defense is just to take the Zumba class with another instructor you know just go go ahead and do the high intensity class but maybe at a different gym or go to the six o'clock class instead of the four o'clock class so you're not seeing that one person who's really causing a lot of disruption in and turbulence in your CV that would just be my initial response to that yeah yeah yes also there's maybe there's a lot of times a very subtle um inference of the way things should be that it sits underneath uh human nature and human thinking in this Arena and that is that people people like to believe that it would be that it is right in proper to not be in conflict um so that that is a that is a mistaken notion so this is not an animal that has some little hormones uh switch on and off uh when it reaches the young adulthood and then locks onto one individual and then it's all wrapped around that individual for the rest of their lives that's not the nature of the species nature of this species is made switching you know intermediate term uh uh both causal mating and parabon essentially it's a scramble it's a scramble competitive environment where uh where people absolutely through the natural history of the organism were it basically often in quranic conflict in other words uh so the so the conflicts that she's having are uh pretty normal for the species and I think as you say because she's in a because she's attractive enough in her 40s inherently and then lost this weight so that she wasn't having these conflicts before but now they are they're re-emerging uh and so this is uh she's also doing something in a place where she's effectively dancing and showing off her body in front of attractive young people without her husband around so she's getting hit on in a way that a lot of times you wouldn't be hit on a stone age environment because those those actions those uh men would not be taking those kinds of risks uh as often and as casually so this is a so this there's nothing in the world wrong with this except that it is absolutely stoking um conflict that it is latent in the system anyway and now you're putting yourself in a position to um you being there by yourself showing off your body in a tight leotard that is that is actually actually a signal okay a leotard like Jane Fonda Style with leg warmers is that that's whatever we call them totally dated reference yeah so anyway yeah so I think what we're saying is hey because you you now live in an extraordinary situation where you can wind up with relatively heavy concentrations of positive feedback uh in in a way that you wouldn't have in the Stone Age the underlying conflicts were there on the Stone Age anyway okay but now you can actually get an awful lot of it and as a result of that that can be putting the thumb on the scale of the CV with respect to how valuable your existing relationship is and it's therefore it can create a lot of turbulence in the system I.E it's just a little bit of a pleasure pleasure trap uh it's we've altered the environment a little bit and it's creating cognitive dissonance no surprise uh so so now we got to to figure out you know are you gonna eat a chocolate sundae or are you going to not you know what I mean this is the this is the kind of uh choices that that people have to deal with I mean it's it's not dissimilar to people saying for example GI keeps staying up late night and watching Gilligan's Island you know I'm the only one that ever talks about feeling Asylum but the point yeah he's on brand with the leotard yeah yeah but that but the point is is it's yeah these uh this super normal stimuli can keep seducing the organism into into spending its time and energy in ways that that can be problematic and have costs associated with it that are not easy to compute when you're when you're in the face of it so that's what the pleasure trap is and and all of us guys it's yeah yeah the other thing that occurs to me too is I don't I don't know this literature well and so I don't know how well demonstrated the effect is or how well replicated it is but I I do know that there's research out there that indicates that there's um vigorous exercises is enhances libido um and uh particularly uh like vigorous cardio exercise and also lifting heavy weights generally like they're I think there are various hypotheses about increased testosterone and um cortisol and all kinds of other things that might be going on so um that in addition to this sort of feedback atmosphere is um there's a lot going on so it makes sense that you would necessarily you might be feeling this way uh on a number of levels so yeah yeah all kinds of exciting things it's also inherently competitive right yes okay so the the entertaining thing to watch is that the women putting on their makeup and doing their hair while they then go to the gym yeah you know what I'm saying it's like that it's the local thing is swirling cauldron of the competition testosterone that's pheromones free free floating yes but yeah probably not trivial yeah excitement well there you go yeah just don't take the class with the super hot guys really that's the easiest thing to do yeah yeah all right okay we've had a couple of others come in here um this is interesting I don't know the answer to this so do females pair bond as a defense against infanticide uh probably to some degree the follow-up there is our our male primates infanticidal um I don't know uh particularly of their own children probably definitely of of not their own children um but of their own I don't know that they're more infanticidal than than any other species or yeah no and there wouldn't be a lot of that yeah in other words it's a it's not so much that they're going to uh be that interested in killing the children of somebody else it's that they're not going to be interested in provisioning them yeah right and they would absolutely be abusive uh and potentially accidentally lethally abusive super neglectable yeah yeah high percentage of those those lethalities are accidental okay so some some you know drug addicted you know adiq Thug uh with with your one and a half year old uh short of sleep uh waxat kid and then and now that kid knocks his head and is dead Okay so it doesn't happen very often but it's not it's not like he goes and breaks the kid's neck or drowns him in the bathtub that's that's not typically what happens in these cases these are accidents of Rage of people right who are at the very end of the bell curve for impulse control and are in situations where they're extremely frustrated and uh and and they wouldn't do it to their own child they they would have the inhibitions uh a whole mother layer of inhibition when it's your own jeans just uh the superb level of inhibition that you know even if you are a super disagreeable um uh human with terrible impulse control remarkably such an individual almost never accidentally uh kills their own child so that that's like an unbelievably world but it's yeah what what is the you've you've given the statistic before that that um is you know uh used in court hearings for example with CPS about how much safer a biological child is even with really shitty parents than with loving adoptive parents um just because of that the genetic share so um yeah right that is incredibly large Martin Daly and Margo Wilson right it's this University in 1980s or 90s and it's yeah that just shows you how deep this this machine is all about your Gins so it's no surprise that when they're not in your genes you're massively less careful I mean think about some other you know worrying about kids running around you know running through the ID if she sees kids run other kids running through the IV she's not that concerned about it but they step on a bottle and cut their foot open oh well that's Mary Lou's kid but if it's their kid they're unbelievably concerned about it and that's exactly what's happening with that situation yeah yeah all right and all right this is a this is a big deep political philosophical question what's what's your take on the best solution for homelessness it's such an issue and there are many solutions people discuss I would love to hear your perspective when there are many other issues impacting it such as addiction and mental health yeah interesting I haven't really given it much thought and uh the it's kind of a I actually don't even know quite what to say an awful lot of the homeless people that I've seen in my life are are kind of making choices to be where is that they are they could be in better circumstances uh without too much trouble I mean there would be some trouble at the wall but they could get to better circumstances but they don't want to be in those circumstances so um so I don't I don't really know you know I haven't thought through what it is that one should do about this yeah it's a curious problem yeah yeah what do you what are your I I never even thought about it Jen I mean thought about it for two seconds but I haven't really thought what should be done I don't yeah yeah I think there's a lot of unappreciated nature of nurture um uh phenomena here so kind of getting to what you're saying that it's it's it's not necessarily a choice in the way that we would tend to think about a choice but that people are going to make series a series of decisions that it is really emerging from these predispositions and their personality and their addictive potential and all of all of these other things that all kind of come together to meet an environment where being homeless is as you know lower cost now in in terms of just certainly a personal impact than perhaps it ever has been certainly in in some places more than others around the country so um or anywhere else it's uh and and so you have you have to some degree uh you know people who yeah it's it's it's it's dodgy to call it voluntary because I mean I think there are some people who are there voluntarily so I've I've met people and I've heard stories about sort of um you know coming coming out of it for one reason or another and get going straight and having you know getting an apartment somewhere and it's just there's something lacking there's an excitement lacking in their life there's sort of the the uncertainty these are very high open emotionally unstable people a lot of the time and there's an attraction to this kind of life on the edge that comes from um even even at the high personal cost uh in various ways of living on the street or living in this really unstably housed way I think there's a different story for everybody who's homeless it's it's one of the problems of talking about homelessness is you you peel the onion away at all and everybody is there for a different reason a different set of personality characteristics a different set of mental health characteristics addiction um volitional Choice bad circumstances there's there's this kind of blank slate notion a lot of the time that oh if only if only people didn't fall down on their luck and they didn't you know have a series of bad things happen to them in a row that all of us are one step away from this and we have talked about this before I think where this is a really common Trope that that oh oh there but for the grace of God you know sort of like oh you're it's just you're just one step away from losing your job and then you can't pay your mortgage and then pretty soon you're you you're just like them and that's very unlikely to be true because you have a different set of um of interests you have a different nature of nurture you're you're drawn in different ways to create a different reality for yourself in in a really literal sense and um so it's not deterministic but it's not just accidental whims of Fate either um and so that makes it a really complex problem and particularly when it's different for every single person who is living in a in an unstably housed kind of situation some of those people I wouldn't you know I think we're not even really supposed to say a homeless anymore we're supposed to say houseless or you know unhoused or whatever whatever the term of art is today um but uh yeah talking about it in any kind of sweeping policy way is just missing the reality of the individual difference that's at the heart of every one of those stories yeah yeah it's kind of curious It's like I I think about like like let's suppose we go 50 years in the future let's suppose that we haven't we haven't solved in other words we've got enough Freedom that everybody's got enough access to enough drugs if they're all we still got the same level of really nasty addiction and um and obviously we know that it's exceedingly unlikely that there's going to be any fix coming from cycle farm for any quote uh any of these things uh that we used to have this concept that that there's it literally in the DSM yeah there was there there used to be what was called two axes to describe problems of human nature one of them was mental illness of various kinds and the other was personality okay well that that is a misunderstanding and that doesn't exist in other words a person's schizophrenia that is their personality okay that's not a mental disease bipolar disorder is not a disorder it's not a disease process it is a personality characteristic okay so is obsessive compulsive disorder it's not a disorder it's just a personality characteristic so when we realize that that's true and we understand that these personality characteristics are derivative of the particular Suite of genes and the people that the people inherited and that a great deal of the presentation of what it is that you're going to see is going to be basically inevitable so your your uh what what you're not going to necessarily what it's not going to be inevitable is if you have say a very paranoid-ish disagreeable uh low conscientious and hope you know in most landscape or low IQ personality you aren't necessarily going to put them in a situation where they're going to become a meth addict okay so that that is I mean you are now in the United States they will eventually find their way there are no probability but they but that isn't true qua humans you you could have a situation where there wasn't any methamphetamine in it and then that person wouldn't be so horrendously dysfunctional uh they would be pretty dysfunctional but they wouldn't be nearly as dysfunctional as they are now given the fact that they are who it is that they are and they do live in a free Society with phenomenal wealth so that they don't literally starve to death yeah and uh they can they can eat out of a McDonald's trash can they can grab their food stamps one way or the other um they may bump into a social worker from time to time that that puts you know the essentially directs them to a food bank in other words they don't literally die even though now there are quite a bit more dysfunctional as a result of the drugs interacting with it an already badly accomplished personality that how on Earth you're going to dig them where are you going to put them in which the truth is they're managing the shopping cart and their little corner of the homeless place that feels about life to them and they don't even trust anywhere else uh they're they're paranoia and their little little bitsy social connections that they have with some of the people there I mean the notion that you're going to take them all out to I don't know the Central Valley somewhere where we've now built homeless City and everybody has a really nice 340 square foot looking apartment and it's all clean and nice and we have a maid come in every week it's like I'm not so sure um if you told them you have to go there then that's an interesting civil liberties question for the society uh and if you but if you don't offer it to them I think I think you know in time we will offer those things uh better than we do now okay but but then you know but then who's going to show up some people will and maybe that will help some some people's lives tremendously uh but I have a feeling that maybe a lot of them won't yeah and I think a lot of them will be at the park in Berkeley uh with the other 150 or 250 uh homeless people and that's where they live and uh and they're not seeing it as tragic that's just the bizarre mind that they live inside and and that mind is as I would say massively more dysfunctional as a result of not only illegal drugs but psychiatric drugs that they've also been exposed to along the way from their Community Health Center so huge importance is there very damaged humans yeah yeah I I have a weird perspective on it because I spent you know my 20s sort of constructively home free at various points in my existence um and you know for those of you who have seen Nomad land have you seen Nomad land yet Doug it's uh as oscar-winning uh Francis McDormand movie about sort of Van life van dwelling in in America and sort of these itinerant workers who you know work seasonally at campgrounds or at Amazon warehouses for the holiday rush and and live in their RVs or their Vans or their Prius and it's a really interesting movie because uh it's not it's not a documentary it's it's a narrative fiction movie but it has all of these real life um people uh you know in addition to the actors in it who I I know from the van dwelling world so it's like oh Bob Wells like I've watched this guy's video I've I've learned how to change a tire on the side of the road from him he knows he has an Alaskan connection too it's very weird um but those those people are absolutely there by choice and they're there because they want to be off the grid they want to be sort of out of the system they they relish the freedom of doing you know having their time be their own and and a lot of them kind of got forced into it by some set of circumstances but then they've embraced it and it's not perfect but um you know they they do it's a it's a lifestyle choice but they're still there we would classify them as homeless or unhoused or unstably housed or whatever it is um and there's huge variation within that group it's not like everybody has some super sweet van set up with a little kitchenette and a nice bed and a portable stove not everyone does some people are really just effectively living in their car and lurching from place to place and kind of getting by with this community and um and so there's just there's there's this huge variety and I I spent so much time with these people and you know living in and out of these kinds of Worlds and seen the attraction to them and having that intersect with my own alcoholism and that making that make more sense in general you know and that's kind of a shared camaraderie that you have with this community and so there's so many different factors here um really really hard to talk about it generally yes good yeah all right what else do we have uh we have the question uh in the chat when is the next beat your jeans episode going to be released or is it summer break now so we had there was an issue with the last one that you and Nate did where he like erased the audio or something Mercury and retrograde problems um he erased his own audio his track yeah so your track survives so we're we know we're behind and we've got Nathan as a traveling uh he's sort of a half flake right at the moment so he should be getting Zach together rapidly and hopefully we'll have a new one this week we we may or may not but if we don't we will for sure have a new one the week after yeah yes yeah I'm not sure where I just saw him in Cleveland last week at the NHA and then yeah I think he was going to Florida or he's zooming around doing other stuff so um yeah not sure when we're recording next but you and I could do a hawk walk this week too we we're behind on that too so one way or another we'll have something out this week um so okay let's see uh we've had a couple of coveted questions you feeling you feeling up for a coveted question or yeah okay uh have your views on vaccination changed I'm in Russia now and the only vaccine available here is Putin's Sputnik five um I didn't know it was called that that's adorable of course rationally I am afraid or Sputnik V I'm not sure of course rationally I'm afraid of getting this vaccine at the same time Moscow is breaking records for the death rate from the Indian variant of the of the virus um in the coming months I will be in contact with more people and it seems like there's a higher chance of getting infected despite all the precautions eighty percent of my friends have had covid I'm 38 not in the risk group but a couple of years ago I had severe pneumonia caused by another virus which makes me anxious what would you do in my shoes what are you doing in Russia what's he doing in Russia I think he lives there maybe yeah interesting problem the I don't know anything about that uh vaccine I I actually know nothing about the Sputnik vaccine I don't know I know the I know about the the Chinese vaccines are looking like they're not very effective um and that those are being used all over the developing world but I think Russia has its own formulation so I don't know if they're the same causing the same kind of problems yeah um I would try to get my hands on some Ivermectin that's what uh what it is that I would personally do the um and I would look at the I think it's called Frontline CCC flccc website uh which is the front flying front line Corona Critical Care Alliance um and I I might I might write to one of those doctors or see if there's any way that you can get your hands on some Ivermectin and whatever else it is that they would recommend um be at 38 years old I would say you know I don't think this Indian variant is going to be anything worse than anything else I think it's uh uh you're you're still looking at the same uh problematic virus and all in all probability the and so I would uh I would say I'm not sure uh what else I would do I probably wouldn't take that vaccine That vaccine uh sounds to me like it's probably pretty dicey I think the Western vaccines are pretty dicey um there's probably ones now that are better than others I actually don't know enough to tell you I know there's a vaccine it's theoretically in the works I think it's um Nova backs or something yeah yeah there's supposed to be more typical of vaccines for humans and it's probably going to be a hell of a lot safer yeah just just generally yeah but not available anywhere I don't think certainly not in the states yet yeah so yeah that's that's a little too far off yeah I don't know you're asking me what I would do uh 38 years old that I would be hopefully you're in decent shape and you're eating pretty decent food you know these are some other questions you know if you're 50 pounds overweight but it's a different situation than if you're not uh but if you're in reasonably good condition if you're smoking cigarettes quit smoking if you're not smoking cigarettes uh and you're in decent physical condition then uh if it were me that's I would try to find my way to some Ira mechan uh based on based on the research evidence that I've seen uh which is under hot dispute around the world and I think there's very interesting uh reasons for that live dispute I I don't trust the pharmaceutical industry in the sense that I believe uh there's been a massive anti uh Ivermectin campaign uh I believe that has been engineered by big Pharma I believe that that's true I could be wrong uh it could be nothing other than grandfatherly a bunkular concern uh that we use Ivermectin we might suffer some side effects um but quite frankly um I think that the that the track record on it as best I can tell is pretty impressive and I would get my hands on it it's cheap uh and it probably my guess is that you can probably get something so I would take a look at the that flccc uh read what it is that they have to say they have a treatment protocol on there that can tell you how many milligrams per kilogram of body weight Etc and that's probably how I would face my time yeah yeah tricky tricky he said he says he does live in Russia not a smoker mostly vegan so got it yeah yeah remember your your statistical odds I don't know what they those would have to be but they are they're exceedingly low that you could die of coded um I think my wild guess would be on the order of one in 25 000 or 150 000 something in that range given those given what it is that you're saying about yourself um but I wouldn't be defenseless in other words if I could uh I would get it get my hands on uh some Ivermectin I think that's that's a reasonable a reasonable uh Improvement of your odds yeah I don't know if that's possible in Russia um but uh yeah I don't know if any or if you could get to Europe if it would be easier to get it in Europe or to I don't know what travel restrictions are like in and out of Russia right now um Europe the this is just a little I don't know if you saw this uh a lot of people have been planning to travel to Europe this this summer um and are all ready to get their EU vaccine passport including British citizens um are not able to because they got the AstraZeneca vaccine which is not recognized by the EU as as approved or at least certain certain batches certain lot numbers or not so these are this this is the moving targets I mean people doing what they think is the right thing to do and they're being compliant with the orders from their overlords and then they still find themselves like oh no actually you have to also go get this additional vaccine on top of the one that you've already gotten which is just a ridiculous scenario so um that could become the case with the Sputnik one as well so right yeah yeah good times I also got another any more another coven thing um no we just had I got a few emails asking for our current thoughts on the vaccines current you know updates just general kind of state of our thoughts on covid I I would say you and I have done uh several hot blocks about this which are they they are subscriber only because I feel that they are um a little bit too edgy to put on a public link on YouTube because we are talking about Ivermectin we're talking about um all kinds of things that very that get much bigger channels than mine demonetized very quickly so um I'm just being very very cautious in keeping those on private links for the moment but they are out there if you want to subscribe as a five dollar member of my patreon you can you can have access to them but um and we we may do that again this week but uh you know if we haven't talked about it in a few weeks either so and if you if you like like to get an earful you go to Brett weinsteins uh yeah totally yeah Brett is the go-to on this um getting getting more and more emboldened as he gets banned you know I think he and Heather and Heather were really kind of walking the line for a really long time trying to do trying to be as absolutely careful as they possibly could and they still got demonetized um and and I think suspended for some amount of time from both YouTube and Twitter um and so now they're just they've moved completely on to Alternative platforms mostly Odysseys where they're live streaming now um and uh yeah Brett's the the kind of go-to for understanding the state of the literature and why why there's a case for Ivermectin um in particular and uh all of the the Top Line concerns about the vaccines these sort of mRNA um U.S vaccines at least so yeah the the Dark Horse podcast that's where that's where they live do we have any other anything else to add any new thoughts or developments um I don't think so I I I don't think my position has changed uh particularly which is my original position was I was going to wait it out let all the other Penguins go under the water and I was gonna see who got eaten and so and that's precisely what I continue to do right now if you're in the United States or in different countries but certainly in the United States covet is an extremely low level at this point so you're you're walking around at extremely low risk at this particular moment we don't know in theory what might happen two months from now or three months or an hour six months from now um but in theory everything should be fine since we've had from the best estimates are that we're somewhere between 100 and 150 million infections uh in covet in the United States uh probably a minimum of 100 million have been natural infections at this by this moment in time and then you've got another God knows 150 million people that have been vaccinated there's going to be some overlap obviously though the um but so probably you're pushing close to somewhere between 150 and 2 probably 200 million people have significant immunity so at that point out of 335 million people you're you're reaching a place where uh the the cowering fear of a towering uh additional wave really doesn't make any sense uh there's there's there'd be no reason for us to predict uh something of that magnitude in other words the the virus's actions should be vastly slowed down uh as as it as some wave may come after the last hundred million people uh but remember when it when it had a virgin audience of 335 million it took forever for it to get to 100 million victims so if you only have 100 million possible victims and it's being slowed down at every turn uh as it tries to bump into new people and one ends up getting essentially uh trunk it's action chunky you should have a slow mild well-controlled easy to see and observed process as it would takes place into our future okay so that's so therefore that's why I'm sitting back on the sidelines uh with a nice clean system with no no doctor Strangelove RNA in me and I'll sit right here and watch the show okay and we'll see what happens what I have observed is I've observed a bizarre looking political actions uh as far as this goes in other words the the uh it's very disturbing to me that that there is such hostility uh on the part of big Tech towards open discussion about these things this is very bizarre and uh really chilling so that the idea that a guy named Brett Weinstein and his podcast uh that he would be defunded and you know demonetized and shut down Community I mean this is ridiculous if anybody watches this guy uh you may disagree with him but uh and very many people may very well but highly intelligent people may disagree with them but nobody on this Earth would ever call Brett Weinstein stupid no and for people if there's if there's anybody who's listening who doesn't know Bretton and his wife Heather I mean these are evolutionary biologists phds they are the ones who got driven out from The Evergreen State University by protesters um several years ago for not Towing the party line on a lot of things um and they they are uh yeah not stupid they're very very well informed they they understand um biology very very well they understand the immune system very very well um and they have interesting points to make and they're not inflammatory in the in the slightest they're incredibly academic with all of their concerns um and they're not trying to make some competitive case against the vaccines they're just saying hey there's some reasons to be concerned there's some reasons to say that maybe the CB here is not a slam dunk or certainly not a slam dunk for people under 50. let's just let's just have it there that's really what Brett's saying these days is like hey all I'm saying is that it looks like maybe the costs are higher than the benefits for people under 50 or without comorbidities and certainly for children um that's really all he's saying he's he's not telling anybody not to get it he's not saying that it doesn't work he's he's just saying let's take a step back and look at the real CB um and for that he's he's been unpersoned yes yes uh absolutely amazing so a a journal called vaccines I think did you send that to me I think yeah yeah yeah it came out with a paper that was uh very very disturbing in what it was reporting uh and just reporting that the vaccines are relative to their benefit uh surprisingly costly and so the that that journal had a whole bunch of people associated with it jump ship basically saying we're not gonna have anything to do with this uh this is amazing so I want to point out that if if you are if you're Colin Campbell and you're a long-term contributor and ad hoc editor for the American journal of clinical nutrition and somebody publishes a paper that says that salmon protein is really really useful for multiple sclerosis and you are sure they're wrong let me explain to you what you don't do you don't say I am so disgusted that's unbelievably irresponsible i revoke my membership in this Association I don't want anything to do with the American terminal clinical nutrition again what okay anybody that does that is not doing that out of the sense of moral righteousness they're doing it out of fear okay if anybody does that they're basically saying don't call me a racist okay they're basically they are they are intimidated professionally by big Pharma and the enormous power that big Pharma has as it reaches down through Health departments and governments so literally you cannot be associated with a journal that has published a paper that says that there is a problem with the cost benefit on a vaccine no you can't you have to literally scream I don't have anything to do with those people yeah that is amazing and that is that I'm seeing the very same you're seeing the reasons why that is not an unreasonable response I'm part of those scientists as you watch Brett Weinstein be demonetized and taken off of YouTube or what are what is 150 plus IQ level discussions with extraordinarily confident people it's like wow so that's what disturbs me uh most about the situation that we're in is that all of us on the sidelines um we are all Flying Blind and we are Flying Blind because we're being blinded we we don't we don't have an open access to open discussions on these things because all of the voices that might have something to say that could be extremely important and useful to be part of this discussion are being silenced by intimidation okay so that's why I am sitting on the sideline watching all the other Penguins go into the water it's like the data say as far as I'm concerned I don't have any other rational position from where it is that I personally sit I sit there watching my 88 year old mother and I'm I think about it you know what I mean she'd like to go to the senior center that might be opening soon and I think I don't think I should send her to the senior center unless she's vaccinated but at the same time the vaccination in uh I can't remember where it was Holland or Denmark or somewhere I think it was Norway we won uh there was it might have been Norway where they gave they gave 30 000 vaccines to elderly people over 80. and they had at least 10 deaths probably closer to 30. so the it looked like the death rate from the vaccine could be easily as high as one in a thousand but just to ground that for people so they understand what that study was about it's it's the the sort of symptoms from the the the the typical symptoms that anybody would get with the vaccine were more um they they were uh they they hastened to the deaths of those elderly people in a way that they were able to identify by taking early like before the people got the vaccine what kind of Health are you in How likely are you to die in the next couple of months you know what are we sort of looking at um and sort of these just expected consequences of the vaccine these flu-like symptoms that the fevers and everything else that these people had was enough to kind of push them into a crisis Zone where where they they died earlier than they would have otherwise and that's just that that that is just what those numbers show so the whole the whole notion being like think about the CV carefully also if you're very elderly and you're fragile and and you could really get taken out by some flu symptoms even if they're brought on by a vaccine so um there wasn't some secret scary process of the vaccine it's it's well documented side effects these adverse effects that a lot of people get um just push them over the edge because of their fragility so um and and older people it's also well documented with all of these that the as you age you you make fewer antibodies as a result of the vaccine so they're they're less better off against covid but they still have these side effects from the vaccine itself and so the totality of that CB looks really really lousy if you're 80 plus um amazing yeah so this is all these are all you know that that's why our attitude from the beginning is from proceed with caution you know and uh and so yeah I think that I don't think that there's good evidence to support it if you're below 50 unless you're got some unusual kind of set of situations um over 50 you know this is my attitude is um once again sort of an interesting thing that's that is sort of passed off and left behind and and basically all discussions is the personal responsibility of your own health you know this is no small thing okay so the smokers people that you know have substance abuse problems people that are obese in a very poor condition these people are um obviously much more susceptible uh to this and so you you have you you are not defenseless uh against this uh really no matter what situation you're in you have quite a bit of control probably very substantial control over the mortality uh the risk that you may face by taking care of business with your own health so that's a you know that that is sort of the undiscussed uh variable here that I think is important important to highlight yourself uh as with our our young man from Russia yeah all right well that's that story and uh I you know I'm I I said I think they're the right thing to do particularly right now in the United States uh for me the right thing for me to do and for my mother is to sit on the sidelines now that we have extremely low case counts this gives us more time for evidence to come in and more time for Innovation um uh I think I'm a little frustrated that that there's been such a vicious uh attack on medical doctors basically being able to to to follow alternative uh treatment regimens uh so particularly with something as promising as Ivermectin and Ivermectin associated in inclusive treatment protocols and so they're being told doctors are being told and patients don't do it unless it's part of a a randomized controlled trial which less ridiculous the uh that doesn't make any sense at all so the had we had the last year and a half of Open Season and open discussion uh I believe we would probably be much further along at understanding uh how to manage and basically reduce the mortality rates but right now if you if you believe uh that for example an ivomexic protocol could help you you can't rest assured as you are sitting in Des Moines Iowa and basically say well if I get coveted I'll just go down to my doctor and have them do the very best treatment that we have available no uh you won't probably get that treatment you'll get something else that is probably not as effective because it's you can get remastered or whatever that is uh because it's extremely expensive uh and therefore it is slipped through the net when it comes to approval for this but the cheap drug that's two cents a tablet no that's your doctor's not allowed to use that or if they do they may risk their professional reputation licensure God knows what so this is it's frustrating that there has not been we have not allowed the medical medical slash scientific Community to openly investigate all Alternatives as a result those all treatment Alternatives and our knowledge and ability to treat um has not you know has not improved dramatically numerically but I see the case fatality ratios as they're published uh they don't it hasn't gone down by the 75 percent that I that I believe is very likely that it should so you still wind up with you know 100 000 infections and you still wind up with 500 deaths that's disturbing to me okay it should have been a hundred thousand uh known infections and it should be down to 200 deaths so we haven't we haven't seen I I believe the uh the increased facility and treatment capability in our medical system that I think is is probably warranted based on what is probably already known that being the case you know the main I'm gonna uh I'm going to be as careful as possible uh with how it is that I manage my Affairs while I let the evidence roll in and also while I wait for the expensive new treatment drug that does what some of the cheaper treatment drugs do that may become available from the karma sometime soon yeah I mean this is we talked about this on the last the last Hawk blocks we did which I still haven't uploaded because I've been traveling and I haven't finished editing it I fell into the the Nate trap um but you know it doesn't take Serious Advanced conspiratorial thinking to look at big Pharma working under an emergency authorization for its experimental drug that it can only use with ex with emergency authorization and the emergency authorization pivoting on the fact that there's nothing nothing else that works I mean that's the only way that you get emergency authorization is if there's no other equivalent treatment and so if there is equivalent treatment particularly if you're not going to make money off of it it's really not that far a leap to imagine being big Pharma doing what it can to suppress conversation about that and and any sort of shared information and published work and everything else and and to shut down YouTube channels Etc et cetera I mean this is this is how it works and pale as old as time there would be right it's just really I mean we've known as you look back in the United States history the I think you've said this and you said this to me uh recently which was a stunning stunning encapsulation that the United States as we sit here on Fourth of July the United States uh was a unique experiment and basically uh essentially trying to organize a society where this doesn't happen so it's trying to organize a society like literally you know the first the first number one in the Bill of Rights okay right there right in our face and so there was a reason for that and um they understood that and number two right to bear arms in other words this was all about by the way this isn't about shooting the guy that comes in you know into your grandmother's house this was all about revoking against the government I mean that's that's that that's what that's about which was the style at the time yeah they couldn't have envisioned Modern Warfare and the phenomenal power of the current uh State operations obviously that the citizens bearing arms now would have no no chance at all for any kind of revolver I guess yeah I'd say this government that's absurd but but the spirit of it was we know that the government and the people in power can get out of control that was the idea and so the idea was to to have a free citizenry uh with a minimum of risk of government oppression and so that um you know and it succeeded uh fighting its way through the the tunnel of incredible incentives to have that not be true and we we sit in a time now where many of us uh understand the incredible value of a free society and the unique uh value and its unique and phenomenal track record uh in terms of improving human existence and we look at the fact that the the defenses of those freedoms are 10 U.S incomplete unpredictable in the future and it's disturbing it's disturbing that that these uh that put it this way if if Facebook and you YouTube were the state and there was nowhere else before uh for me to hear of Brett Weinstein wow what a voice and what a discussion to be lost okay that that that's become Soviet Russia so you know we aren't we aren't there and that isn't where we are thank goodness but it's disturbing to watch uh major forces behave that way uh but it's also not in not particularly surprising uh because Jen and I have talked about this It ultimately comes down to energy conservation in other words if you can if you can put a gun to somebody's head and empty their pockets of gold why would you go mine it yourself okay and so this is that that is that is why it is the history of the world is Warfare oppression slavery and exploitation I mean that is that is what what a vast amount of human society organization has always been and even within our magnificent country that is still obviously you know it is so obviously if you can get in on it it is an incredibly attractive way to behave remains true you know what I mean so that's that's what we we continue to we watch uh I think pretty extraordinary dramas in this regard now as we see some consolidation of power in some big companies uh that uh that of likes of which we probably haven't seen since maybe the early 20th century you know I mean automobiles steel coal you know I mean there was there was times when uh I don't know my history well enough I just know I know that I can't remember there's some incident where some railroad King told everybody nobody can use this this bridge and like all this all the action stops bringing food into New York or what I I completely lost what this was it might have been 1880s but the point is some some big Robber Baron literally had too much power and was going to squeeze and so that you know that tendency of human beings to behave that way hasn't gone away and we're going to need to evolve and uh yeah we're going to need in order to continue the free the American experiment we're going to need to continue to evolve ways to make sure that that people remain free but that's how I see that that makes sense yep yeah it makes some sense there's just so so many other things we could talk about but we're already over time so we haven't even gotten into all of the uh this whistleblower uh you know telling the real story about China's role in this whole thing and concerns about the I mean this the kova just being very seasonal and so we're we're at a low point just generally and this [ __ ] could really hit the fan in the fall and winter and oh man there's just so many other things all right well there's plenty more to talk about well we'll just keep the conversation going in one format or another so um I just total aside while you're talking about the founders and the unique project of the founders and the you know the greatness of the founders Jeffrey Miller had a tweet this morning just as a reminder of how old these guys were they were all like 25 you know they were like Hamilton I think was 20 or one of them was 18 maybe maybe Monroe like they were the oldest among them was you know in their 30s 35 like these were young dudes it's incredible it's just incredible it was a I just found it remarkable that 21 year olds could have such perspective and foresight and self-restraint well I think I can't remember didn't didn't Adams and Jefferson die in 1825 or so or 50 years since 26. this right at the 50-year date on on July 4th I believe oh yeah there you go so that means that Jefferson and Jefferson so yeah that would mean that he was writing the Declaration when he was 30. isn't that incredible yeah yeah Jefferson was 30 33 in 76. yeah that's just chilling what a what an extraordinary almost unbelievable group of human beings the uh I think they'd all be Libertarians yeah I think they would I just okay for everybody you know what I mean yeah well like we're a Libertarian yeah they're classically libertarian oh man yeah that's that's a whole other conversation there's planning a foot for the uh the 200 and the the 250th birthday celebration and all of this there's there's talk like oh how do we how do we celebrate the problematic history of America and and uh you know you can't can't have it like we had the bicentennial that was a that's a lost era um so yeah yep there you go happy Fourth of July everybody all right so great enjoy yes likewise and you guys keep us keep us posted with any questions that come up and we'll tackle them in one form or another as we go so all right all right see everybody later yeah okay
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