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Episode 10: Biological Clock, Sexual Variety, Settling Down, and Male Groupies
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last week we discussed love dating sex relationships marriage and all the psychological aspects that come with that and how we can possibly beat our genes to find happiness in this regard so this week we got a lot of good comments from last week's episode and we'll jump into some questions in a moment but but I wanted to go over a really a movie I watched a long time ago this is again last week we were talking about Billy Crystal and Robert DeNiro but it was another movie with Billy Crystal and Meg Ryan called one Harry Met Sally and this kind of leads this off into this whole love dating sex relationships as men and women are always trying to find sex they're trying to be friends they're trying to they're trying to connect in a certain way and in this movie Harry was Billy Crystal's character tells Sally that that's not possible for men and women to be friends so look in here for a second Carrie and this is not a come-on in any way shape or form is that men and women can't be friends because sex part always gets in the way that's not true I have a number of men friends and there is no second of all yes I do yes I do you're saying having sex with these member that my knowledge no what I'm saying is they don't want to have sex it thank you mm-hmm because no man can be friends with a woman that he finds attract he always wants to have sex with so you're saying that a man can be friends with a woman find unattractive well you pretty much won another limb to what if they don't want to have sex with you doesn't matter because the sex thing is already out this ad offensive is ultimately doomed in that at the end of this building what are your thoughts dr. Loe that's a that's a very sweet scene the it is uh it is not true of course but it makes for a great illustration of of the differences between men and women and so in that way it's it's a priceless scene I actually we could talk more about this particular movie if people have seen it it's a classic and it that actually in my view When Harry Met Sally is one of the great tragedies in in romantic cinema it's not recognized as such because the chicks do not understand that it is a tragedy but when Harry Met Sally is in fact a tragedy because Harry is not into Sally and he marries her out of friendship which is a disaster Betty right we can come back to that later on well it will tell us more because because last week we talked a little bit about how men can actually be pressured into marriage by females and when in fact they may not actually ever want to be in a marriage and so this can be a disaster for both parties yeah that was the the story of this relationship was that was that as harry and Sally you know Harry was may be interested in her very early but then he really wasn't after they got to know each other and so they were friends and then and then they go about their separate ways did and then she has a breakup with this tall handsome guy played by Gerald Ford's son and any race so she breaks up with him and he was the big he was the guy who was supposed to be the center of her life and that she was going to have kids with and get married but didn't happen and so he breaks up with her and then and so then in in the aftermath of that breakup Harry turns excuse me Sally turns to Harry and essentially in a pitiful process sort of comes on to Harry and they sleep together and Harry wasn't really into it he did it just because in effect it was it actually was a it was a friendship support process that takes place and and then then she you know for whatever reasons she finds Harry acceptable enough and yeah the that bit not being necessarily that high of a priority for her and he then because they are such good friends he basically gets boxed into this relationship so the it is a it is a horrendous story because the notion is is that this actually fits female psychology in a way that it does not fit male psychology the the longer that a female knows a male the longer she knows him the more likely it is that she will sleep with him and the reason is is that females value safety very very highly in sexual situations they value people that are familiar that are known that they know their character etc etc in other words they're designed by nature to to have it put place great value on stability and knowledge of the person whereas males do not have that situation for the very reason that the male cannot be effectively raped by a female his resources his reproductive resources cannot be rested from him by a female by force neither can a female take advantage of him and then abandoned him these are all tremendous issues if you're a female of our species and so as a result and other species this isn't an issue but in our species females are designed by nature to desperately try to get ahold of male resources in addition to the males DNA and so as a result they value someone who is sticking around who is known to their social circle and whose behavior is known in this case Harry is a successful young lawyer and therefore he's got good solid money he's never been unemployed there's never been any issue this were just he this he's a highly educated six-figure solid guy and so that winds up with Sally in her mid-30s with her biological clock ticking which they make a significant issue out of she actually essentially in the aftermath of a breakup she says what the hell I'll take Harry and and Harry was never into her not not since they're made perhaps very initial meeting before he knew who she was and and is not attracted to her they had been friends for years and they have been not attracted she has not been coming on to her and men do not have a situation where they are not interested in some woman for years and years and then suddenly become interested this is not characteristic of male psychology if a female meets criteria in terms of sexual attractiveness then excuse me if she does not meet criteria she does not raise in sexual esteem with knowledge of her character that is not true for males males can absolutely rise in terms of their sexual acceptability as women get to know who it is that they are and feel safer so from the standpoint of a female watching this movie the movie makes complete sense to females because after all you know Harry you know if he's a good guy of course he really loves her so of course she's a pretty enough cuz she's prettier than he is so yeah of course all it is is his commitment phobia that he has to get over and that he'll be fine and he'll be very happy with Sally well this is entirely bullshit the truth of the matter is is that harry has never been interested in Sally he is not sexually attracted to Sally he loves Sally as a friend and and a male is not quote sexually attracted to some female and then not know it or she is not acceptable and him not know it this is not not how males work so Sally does not become acceptable over time as as they get to know each other better she is firmly in the non sexually interesting but very sweet friend location in his mind and gets boxed into this thing I will be sure to not have my sisters and my mother listen to this part of the show because they absolutely adored that movie and my dad kind of just said well I guess I guess they want to watch it so we'll watch it too right and you'll find that yeah females this resonates with female psychology but they have no intuition about male psychology here When Harry Met Sally is an American tragedy and that tragedy takes place whenever some guy gets cornered into a relationship by various and subtle social pressure and then winds up being married one of my one of my my very earliest experiences clinically was with a it was at the Family Institute at the University of Virginia where they did Family psychotherapy and the the therapist there was a man by the name of dr. David waters known to be very assertive and full of guts and and dramatic and all the sort of stuff so I was very interested to take this special graduate seminar and watch him work it was one of the rare times when we you know I give dr. waters credit it's one of the rare times when you actually got to see a psychotherapist actually work because usually they hide behind textbooks and you never know how they actually work so we got to watch dr. waters work with a with a couple and that couple was a female a woman probably in her mid to late 30s and she had was divorced and had a daughter that was about eight six maybe about six and so she was a single mom and might have had a son I can't remember but I don't think so I think she just had about a six-year-old daughter and maybe I think there was a second kid so anyway they meet this these this guy meets I don't know if they're Church and this guy's a really nice guy and and and I remember watching the the therapy sessions where there it's coming on Christmas and and the guy says you know people shouldn't get their hopes up because there was definite definite pressure in the wind about that they should get married because they were living together and and what what transpired was interesting dr. Watters was following the standards for the gutless line that that that there was something not right about this guy that he that there was some sexual issues because he he didn't seem to be very interested in her and and yet he he eventually over the last three or four months that we observed there of these sessions he did get they did get married but then it was in trouble and the wife was in there sort of complaining and trying to try to drag him into therapy about this and it was obvious to me what the truth was this guy was not into this woman and yet dr. Watters was not seeing the handwriting on the wall it was so obvious there was nothing at all about this situation where this guy was in any way Beadie n't odd or anything else this was just a nice guy who met this lady at church you know was probably a little bit attracted to her at the beginning then his kid his little daughter six-year-old daughter just loved this guy because he was a sweet man and so he got connected into this family as a member of the coalition and as a member of this church situation and then they get known as a couple and then he couldn't get out and and that was an early tragedy that I witnessed and nobody stood up for this guy and gave him the words or the assertiveness to support what was obviously taking place okay so on the same line look I we got a lot of comments from the last episode and a lot of a lot of different questions from a lot of different people so in this line of thinking let's just get right to it and you know there's there's people out there that posted comments saying that that the hook-up culture our days and this concept of hypergamy do you think that it will lead to less marriages or fewer long-term relationships well I think that I think that what you're seeing is you're seeing a a we talked about this before that you're seeing a a mega trend that is taking place now that that began as follows so I'm not going to spend a lot of time on this but 10,000 years ago we were hunter-gatherers and the male's were looked as by females as primarily what was primarily important was how sexually attracted the male was and and secondarily he was a member of the village where he could bring protection village protection as well as it was his job to hunt so there was some protection and provisioning quality stem L but but remember what was not there there was not expectation that the male would bring wealth per se or that the male would stick around for 15 or 20 years and raise a child that was not expected that was not part of the village deal and so if a relationship would last for a few years that would be a lot and if a male would stick around for you know four or five years and be with a female through through the early first few years of this child's life that would be pretty substantial stick-to-itiveness and that that would have been consistent with the natural history of our species now with the dawn of Agriculture and eventually with the with the importance of wealth and passing on wealth to offspring suddenly it becomes very important to get as much wealth as you can provisioning on top of children's heads for their whole lifetime and so the male's sticking around longer and rules about finances and so on and so forth basically force male and females both into marriage which marriage now evolves spontaneously out of human culture not because it's part of human natural history but it's actually a response to wealth the without wealth you're not going to have marriage you're going to have relationships in this particular species that are going to have a phenomenon known as love where they are connected up and interested each other for a long periods of time you know months or years but you're not going to have this this long-term knock-down monogamous process that has been the ideal for the last 10,000 years as instituted by church and law that those are those are totally unnatural processes and so that they've been necessary to protect the precarious financial position of illegitimate children or children without a father's protection so as a result now in cultures where women are becoming successful enough financially that their children will not take a big hit that they're that they're children which they can actually support their children well you now are going to find that women are not going to be nearly as interested in being married indefinitely and and the men certainly are not and so you are watching now phenomenon what you call the hookup culture is actually a culture that with birth control women are now able to exercise sexual choice behind their lust circuits in a way that they always have but not to the extent that they're able to do so now and so we know from sociological data that goes back 100 years into the early 20th century where we've collected data you know in the 1920s and 1930s on human on human beings and preferences and mating behavior we know that in the 1920s the females were not very did not rate a males as highly important when it came to a marriage partner what they looked at what was important was there their prospects economically that is vastly less true today okay so what you've seen over the last 80 or 90 years is you've seen a slow but steady decline in the importance of the male's financial circumstances even though they remain important they do not have nearly the power now to fix ugly looks that they did eighty years ago and so females are now responding much more like the Stone Age females where the male provisioning is somewhat important but what becomes very important to them is their sexual excitement about the male and the sexual excitement is being driven by their estimations of their gene quality or their handsomeness and so does the amount of sexual partners that we have over our lifetime does that affect future happiness either for both men and for women well actually there are there are big individual differences between the sexes on this and there's also large individual differences within the sexes on this so if you if you look at typical males a typical male would like to have I think it's about 25 or 30 sexual partners in their lifetime in other words they they just have that sense that that's about as much novelty and they feel like they will have covered the ground if that's about as far as they got females it's much less it's it's on the order of 10 I think or so so you're seeing that that as you would expect males would be much more interested in novelty and variety and females would be significantly less so and I think that and and females are certainly in a position to realize sexual novelty a hell of a lot more than males are because they're the controlling factor on sexual activity and so you're going to find you're going to find people today are going to be more satisfied in that area of their life than they have been in the past you know several centuries just because they because of birth control and because of the the lack of tragedy associated with unwanted pregnancy unit you now have and therefore women it used to be the case that the average number of mayor of sexual partners that a woman went to her grave with was three that was very that was the standard very typical number was three with you know just a few on each side of that was was standard so whole boys right but that does that include pool boys includes the pool boys so yeah that that would have been true this is sort of 1950s even 1960s generation females so now that's going to be different so I'm not sure what the current numbers are but they they have risen dramatically in the last twenty or thirty years and so women are our people are able to to essentially experience they're more of their of the novelty that would have been typical in Stone Age and so they feel like they're there's less likely that they have missed out as much as they would have felt in 1950 but that but that aspect is still there and the gravity of marriage and the pressure of law expects I'd a pressure of long-term committed relationships still remains a fairly oppressive force in human affairs okay so so this is this is actually a it kind of brings me to one of the comments that came in from last episode is how much does culture influenced this this sexual market and the dating game and marriage for example in cultures they still have a relatively strong marriage system in place whereas in Western cultures it may not be as strong and then does religion or lack of religion play any role in this certainly I mean these things what you're seeing is you're seeing religions influence in this you know would have arisen for at the beginning of agrarian society so this is all about protecting both males and females genetic interests so the there are cultures around the world very backwards cultures that are that are down on birth control and so this is a you know this is obviously a whole other episode but I mean these people remain in by the millions in the United States today so there's a there's a bizarre human fascination with the idea of somehow maximizing gene reproduction I mean it's just astounding that this is how people think but but the truth of the matter is is that when you're going to have situations where you're going to have children are expensive they are biologically expensive creatures for human beings are and they are expensive in the modern environment and so and particularly in in more more sort of primitive cultures with primitive economic systems and the inability of women to make a decent living there's just no way you can you can responsibly be a female and be having children out of wedlock this is not going to this is not going to be happening so the these sexual events are going to be very carefully monitored and planned and people are going to be bullied and this is what we call quote a stronger religious force whether it's in the United States or elsewhere what you're really seeing is you know there's going to be multiple reasons for this you know we could add a bunch of sociological you know equations into this but the bottom line is is that you see a tremendous amount of intimidation and pressure as well as real life financial problems associated with having children that result in people quote being in stronger marriages which means that people are much less happy okay and then so in those cultures why is it that promiscuity and females tends to be looked down upon whereas promiscuity and males tends to be like okay well I guess that's just the way it is yeah I think that what you're seeing quote what when you say quote look down upon your you're seeing things from the male point of view and these are these are male-dominated cultures male dominated religions and you are seeing essentially the following process that in essence this is what's taking place unattractive relatively unattractive males with resources are in power and as a result what they can do is that they can essentially out-compete handsomer males that maybe younger without resources in order to get more attractive wives those those attractive lives need to be under a tremendous amount of intimidation to stop those females from being impregnated by by their attractive possible mates young men who may be very very interested in them and likewise and so as a result we put a bunch of clothing draping all over the females and make them unable to show themselves and we move stone them if they're caught you know sleeping with anybody that they're not supposed to and so on and so forth I mean these are just these are now exaggerated versions of what you would see in a lot of sort of oppressive oppressive subcultures within the United States the that what you're seeing is is that that by virtue of a an economically dependent and and essentially boxed in female the females are boxed in to mating choices and mating situations that they're really not very happy with and as a result they have to be intimidated they have to be controlled as much as possible and and and of course quote female promiscuity is looked down upon because the if the wealthy male is now if turns out that he's raising somebody else's kid that is a biological disaster for him so there's going to be there's going to be tremendous force there there would be yeah there would be plenty of criticism for the male oppression in this situation if a female could raise her voice but since she's not allowed to raise her voice and has no access and ability to do so you don't hear those voices the only voices you hear are from the dominant the dominant members of that culture I mean it makes sense when it comes to those oppressive cultures and of course I live in liberal state and so I'm sure can't compare to some of the more extreme examples of oppressive societies but but in my experience all of the shame for promiscuity and the experience of my friends has come from women women have are far more likely to shame other went for being promiscuous yeah at least in my experience experience of my friends there's no no question that that's true so the there's also going yet there this is all when you start to realize how many different mating agendas and people's agendas there are this gets very this gets to be very very complicated game theory so the it's you know not not super complicated but just complicated enough to be tricky and so what I was talking about when I talked about male-dominated cultures and males dominating the females reproductive equipment and and their lives that is all very very true the however it is also the case that that our women are very nervous about other women being promiscuous and the reason that's true is because promiscuity and women essentially destabilizes the village so the and so this is this means that women in effect have to work as a low-grade conspiracy where they essentially are trying to pressure each other into pair-bond behavior if they can and so there are they want to they're going to try to disturb or hurt the reputations of other other females if other females are sexual competitors so you're not going to see for example an eight female criticizing a five female for being promiscuous not very likely but you will see a five email criticizing an eight female for being promiscuous whether she is or not and the the reason is is that if they it's a gamble to try to reduce the the quote from askew as female sexual attractiveness possibly to to any mates that that that that that that are that are say less attractive female would be interested in now they wouldn't have to be less attractive so if you can think in principle about two females who are Apes that are competing for pretty well the same males in a mating pool it would be a a risky but potentially useful strategy to if you you are let's suppose that you are the brunette female and the other one is a blonde then you may want to criticize the blonde behind her back about being promiscuous in order for to reduce the blonde mating cachet as a para bond target for the males that you are interested in well the problem is is that that you will increase the blondes a mate value to males in terms of a casual mating strategy target and so and this can be a problem because causal mating can very often turn into pair bonds so that often happens just that way so as a result this is a risky strategy but it but it is definitely a strategy that appears to have been evolutionarily stable in other words it appears to be a very useful strategy in terms of its net effect for females to criticize other females who are sexually attractive and try to hit them at the level of character to try to reduce their overall mate value to the males so this is but you will see part and parcel to this behavior in the Middle East where there's some very unattractive females who have no problem wearing a burka ok and it's like look we all need to be wearing these things so nobody gets to show off their sexual attractiveness ok so this this is part of the way that bizarre-looking pretty brutal social practices can become entrenched in systems because all it takes is enough of a majority of the power with enough complicit behavior on the part of both sexes and now we wind up into a situation where a certain subset of people can be under a hell of a lot of pressure and oppression now ok so why does promiscuity disturb the village this is this is actually I'm not a fairly curious yes well just think about think about 10 women and 10 men in a village and they're all pair bonded and let's suppose that the third most attractive female out of this so we got 10 9 8 so we've got a the 8 the 8 female who's bonded to the 8 male has a little wild streak so she's promiscuous so she's willing to sleep behind his back ok the problem is is that that if she does this this will potentially destabilize the whole village because now the the people that she's going to be most interested in are going to be the mr. 9 and mr. the two most attracted males and so as a result if she starts sleeping with mr. 9 then there are many conflicts that have just been stoked so so mr. 9 is now sleeping with his 9 wife but he's also sleeping with the d8 chippy on the side this puts him in direct conflict of interest with the man who is an 8 it also puts her in vicious competition the 8th female is now in competition with the 9 so now that the reasons for resources is it no they're actually in competition yeah ultimately they're in competition for mr. nines pair-bond affections so as a result this is this is now disturbing that pair-bond dramatically and and so that you you now have a whole host of problems and with the whole village watching you know you now have a destabilized situation people are going to take sides this is going to be social pressure brought to bear etcetera so this is a you know these two guys could wind up so pissed off at each other that that they have to break up the village and so this is anybody that's ever hung around or even heard of read any stories of a band you know this is what goes on all the time in a band so you've got five guys and five girlfriends and pretty soon you're going to have trouble and and this is this is what goes down in in situations like that so there's a lot of there's a lot of pressure the females can can essentially act as a little group of hens to try to put a lot of pressure on from is promiscuous female to get her act together in essence to raise the price of the promiscuous behavior by potentially being shunned by the group that's a very that makes that behavior very expensive for that female and therefore discourages it so is a is a person who sleeps with many people like many one-night stands are they running after social validation or is that just a pop psychology you know manipulation tactic used to shun the person yeah I don't even know what the hell that means describe to me what anybody means by social validation well so this wasn't my question this was one of the questions posed on the comments section and right but I read I read through it and and basically the theory according this particular user and this particular forum was that people who sleep with several people are doing it just to get some social validation to get the you know the the feel-good words and you know to be honest I don't really know but now that they bleep around to get the nice words and all that no I don't think so at all I mean there is a there's quite a few different motivations for sexual behavior the primarily but by far the primary reason is that it's it's the most heavily rewarded behavior in nature behind the pleasure circuits so that it can because you need to do those little literally do those movements in order to reproduce DNA so if you want to know why people have sex is because they like it okay just the way all other animals do so a person that that sleeps with a lot of people the you you're going to look at that that question from two different angles whether you're looking at it from the female angle or from the male angle if you're a male and you're sleeping with a lot of people then then this is you know if there are as the females are attractive enough to you and you're able to have sex with a whole bunch of them then you are what's known in nature as a successful male for god sakes so you aren't doing this for social validation you're doing this because this is behavior that took place for the last several million years in our lineage that and the males that walk the earth today are almost entirely descend of males who were very successful at pulling exactly this problem off okay so that is absurd to look at this as social validation this is you need to look at it as the natural novelty seeking drive of a male is attempting to in principle and I say in principle because you're not consciously trying to do this today but in principle his behavior is simply directed at impregnating large numbers of females like that's that's all he's up to and that's all he should be up to according to his biology so I don't see anything the only nails that I've seen that pulled this off were uniformly highly attractive males you know Kareem abdul-jabbar and Wilt Chamberlain exactly in other words there are attracted males charismatic males etc that that were able to pull this off so these are not disgusting people these are people that are the envy of their peers for God's sakes and what about women yeah women is a different issue so women women can be occasionally can be very promiscuous it's not typical of the female of our species but it is true for some of them and if you think about this remember that most males that reproduce of very few males are extremely successful in terms of a promiscuous behavior pattern in other words they just can't pull it off so a lot of males evolved a strategy that the male of the species evolved the strategy that we're going to call a love strategy where they are willing to stick around with one and and hang out with her for a number of years and be fascinated with her little offspring that kind of looked like him and etc etc so that that's a true love strategy that evolved in our species alongside what was what was originally simply nothing other than raw lust casual mating strategy now you have to remember that male humans are going to differ considerably not just by their circumstances but also by their natural biology so for example there are going to be males and females that are far more pair-bond strategy oriented than other males and females and so if you can imagine a male who happens to be a wild crazy you know casual mating strategy monster and let's sit but let's just for sake of argument let's say that he let's say that he's also attractive enough and resourceful enough but he's able to live out this strategy and be perfectly effective and throughout the course of his life he's sleeping with half a dozen or so people a year so by the time he's forty he has slept with over a hundred women in his life and he's going to sleep with another fifty or a hundred before he's done now think about the psychology of that man he's not that much of a para bonder he doesn't get that close in that tight he doesn't care that much about the females feelings in other words he's willing to lie to them to get him into bed and then leave him after he's done and so now think about that those genes of that personality happened to wind up in a daughter of his along the way so he's got let's say he's got 50 children and 25 of them are girls well those girls some of them are going to be likely to be very much like him that they are that there are going to be novelty seeking as hell with respect to sexuality and that they are they are not going to be that pair-bond connection-oriented and as a result they may feel some love circuits in there just like just like our hard-core male does but they can still be fascinated enough with casual sex that they can be very promiscuous and they're not seeking social validation or anything else they too are are seeking a are actually seeking something else that that we we see in which is that by making let's suppose our girl is an 8 and she's got this sort of casual mating strategy psychology it's going to turn out that if she if she follows her lust cues or her her lust responses then what will happen is this will mean that she will sleep with a great many people but the people is she's going to sleep with are very likely to be sexier than she is because because she is able to hit up the nines and the tens males who and and by coming on to them and showing that she's going to be very easy that she is not needing a love relationship she doesn't even need three days she's flirting with him right off the bat and giving them cues that she'd sleep with them immediately now what what's happening there is that she is sleeping up and not asking for any resources which means she's making it a very inexpensive for a for the male and if the male is somewhat casual mating strategy oriented and he's willing to take her up on it then that means that most of the sperm that winds up inside of that female during her mating career are going to be fancier more sexy sperm than the ones that she is than the eggs that she's bringing and as a result any offspring that would come about from living a strategy like this would tend to be sexy offspring a sexier than then she is herself and so this is why it is that some females are going to have this kind of behavior you do not typically see females have this kind of behavior and sleep down that is not characteristic of female mating strategy now now when looked at let's let's take this example little further and by the way if does anybody wants to call in for some comments we've got six five seven is the phone number six five seven three eight three zero seven five one again the number is six five seven three eight three zero seven five one okay so let's say now this woman is having a great time in her 20s and even in her mid-20s and even maybe in her late 20s and then thirty years old hits she's starting to think you know she's got that biological clock coming where now she's thinking oh Jesus if I'm gonna have kids now is the time to do it does the fact that she has now had partners in the past that were all nines and tens will that prevent her from being happy dating a man who now who should be who's gonna want to bond with her well I think that's a great question and I think that and I think that is very the answer to that is very possibly yes in other words you you will see that and I have certainly seen in my practice situations where females that do not understand this about their own psychology they don't know what the hell they're doing there they're just animals that are acting essentially on impulse I mean they have thoughts about it and they talk with their friends and they me talk to their psychologist but nobody knows what the hell's going on that female does not know that she has a casual mating strategy streak and that as a result what she has done is she has availed herself of 40 highly attractive males that are more attractive than she is and because of all the positive feedback that she's gotten from them that they've been eager to get into her pants she's effectively got herself over calibrated and now the truth is is that although if she's an eight and the nines and tens males are very eager to sleep with her but not a single one of them it's been interested in pair bonding with earth and not only that eighths are not interested in pair bonding with her either because eight males are trying to sleep up when it comes to care bonding and females are essentially they're not obliged to sleep down but that is very typical that is the typical case in our species and so as a result of that her real market is the seven and so the but but that seven is going to leave her could leave her very flat so I I do believe that that raises a challenge for females and you know so be it the truth of the matter is is that these are these are bizarre problem that you are now concocting in the modern environment in a world that is inconsistent with the natural history of our species a female with that psychology with enough novelty seeking in her psychology that and and enough willingness to engage in sexual behavior with minimum of psychological and material investment by males it's essentially someone who would had been playing a sex of what we call a sexy son strategy or sexy son hypothesis that her offspring would have been very sexually attractive more sexually attractive than herself because her mates would have been more attractive than her because they would have been sleeping down and and she would have been a single mom and that's that that's half of that game plays and that is not the most typical strategy for the human female but is absolutely a common variant of female sexual psychology and yeah I think it's tough I think it's uh it's a tough one okay so so the beat the jeans here is is if you're put into this situation kind of understand what what's happening there yes I think that it is it is the case that females over time will will tend to increase their attraction to males to are of good character and are resourceful and so but they the female has general female particularly a casual mating strategy oriented female has very little intuition about this because she may have never had that experience and when people told her hey you should go out with Horace he's a good guy and she's gone out with him dutifully because she had a bunch of friends and her mother had hooked her up or something and she went out with him three times and nothing happened and she says see that doesn't work it's just bullshit okay I really like Nick the guy with the tattoo and the hearing and sorry that's just how it is and so the bottom line is is she could easily be convinced and unaware of a potential that resides inside of her nervous system to increase her feelings of attraction for a male who is very interested in her but does not immediately strike her as sexy that potential probably exists in her but it's not going to be that easy for her to find it not nearly as easy it is it is for a typical female and which she will she always kind of pine after that you know musician Gaara type a guy even hoarse depends upon how depends upon how AB not necessarily at all the it depends upon what the what that bonding looks like what the oxytocin is in that relationship etc so she may find for herself the ability to hit a good groove but what I'm saying is is that there's a good chance she'll never find it because she doesn't she doesn't know where to look mm-hmm okay now onto this whole like rock star you know while we're on this topic um one of the comments was why are there no male groupies I don't know if this is yeah or not but but I mean I would think that there are way more female group is than male cooties yes what what's the cause of well the the truth of the matter is is that the that the the the females are chasing extraordinary male DNA the DNA that was required to fight their way to the top of the dominance hierarchy as difficult as for example being a musician so that is quite a test of fitness and so a male that that is these are essentially sexual attractiveness displays they are they are in our species there are several displays that are typical singing dancing in athletics and beauty and houses or just material well these are these are the biggest some of the some of the main the main Fitness indicators that we display but males are not particularly interested and females who fight their way to the top of dominance hierarchies they don't give a shit okay males just want to know how good you look so if you're if you're a female rock-and-roller who is an eight and there are and there is there is some girl that's sitting on this in the side of the show there that's a nine the guy in the audience is a hell of a lot more interested in the nine that is that is in the in the audience than he is in the eight that's on the stage he couldn't care less about the eights magnificent singing abilities or hurt Annette tenacity to climb dominance hierarchies it is not an attractive Fitness indicator for males to observe this whereas that is not the same case on the other side remember also if there are if there are males booing and eyeing in the audience over female this is not particularly attractive to other males that that other males would find somebody attractive and that they would be interested in them for casual mating or that a female on the other side of this would look like she was interested in casual mating because that would just mean that you were going to come there was no way to pair bond with that female and your your odds of getting there are extremely remote to have sex with her because she's going to be very very selective and etc so this is all this is all a fiasco and males just don't give a damn whereas on the other side the flipside females are they could be they could pass on this extraordinary sexual attractiveness that a male rock star has achieved and that rock star could impregnate her and a whole lot of other women this year and if she has a little son that is uh that is similar to that rock star then that son may dominate the mating arena of his of his social future and so there is just no there is no great profit in women climbing dominance hierarchies but there is tremendous profit in males climbing dominance hierarchies we as males are all ready attuned remember we do not seek resources from females as males we do not females seek resources from males this is a tremendous difference ok so as a result a male who has fought his way to the top of the dominant hierarchy is a male who is indicating capability at resource acquisition whereas a female that fights her way the top of dumbest hierarchy I don't care I'm not looking to her for resources my job is to look at her body and her face and to observe whether or not she is an idealized physical specimen and to the extent that she is less than perfect I'm I'm taking away points and so I I couldn't care less whether she's the president of IBM or she's the president of the United States or she's anything else under the Sun and any other achievement it's not relevant what's relevant is her waist hips ratio and how pretty she is and whether or not she's got a beautiful smile with white teeth sorry but that's just how it is and that's that's inside the male psychology is and you know I read as I call it I read something a while ago that said that it was basically comparing female happiness compared to how how much hierarchy had climbed in life ie is a medical doctor female or as a CEO who's a female going to be happier because she's climbed up that ladder and it actually said no the higher she climbs the less happy she's gonna she's gonna be because she's gonna be more selective with mates who can you know there's gonna be a lot fewer CEOs we're gonna gonna be able to you know she's gonna be able to look up at right yeah that's I mean I don't this is just a the issue is is that our achievements inside who we are inside large law our intelligence or accomplishments and so on and so forth what these do is that they don't typically make us a lot more sexually attractive what they do is this - mating tears and so females are you know in particular they they're their mate value is overwhelmingly determined by their physical appearance and the rest of it their intelligence or their accomplishments assigns them to people of similar characteristics it does not elevate their sexual attract who are you there yep no I'm there yeah so so this is this is somewhat different from males not hugely but somewhat so it's it's a little bit sloppier on the male end because females are looking for resources so they are willing to trade looks for resources males are never willing to trade resources for looks other words to trade the same way a male does not find an accomplished female more sexually attractive doesn't happen so to the extent that women want to accomplish things they should accomplish because it's it's fulfilling its desirable they want to do it rather than it's going to make them more attractive yeah it's not going to make them more attractive at all it's going to all it's going to do is mark them for a for attachment and males so that that's what you're doing that's what you know that's what that's about and I think that women should achieve things and try to achieve financial independence essentially because it you want to be in a position of power throughout the course of your life with respect to your sexual choice so if you wind up married now have a couple of kids and then don't want to be married then you want to be in a position where you are not dependent and so it's it's very important logistically for women to be accomplished but it does not increase their sexual attractiveness yet make less money and be more fit that's a much better strategy for females who are trying to find mates that they find attractive to find them attractive
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